Classic Car Magazine

Renault & Alpine General Discussion
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Postby stephendell » Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:04 pm

I've received a complaint from a CAR committee member regarding Clee's 'obscene' comments in this thread and their detrimental effect on club relations. It was suggested that these comments should not have been allowed or moderated and that had he been a CAR member further action would be have taken against him.

In the interests of transparency and improving inter-club relations here is copy of the relevant section of my reply that I sent after reviewing the matter:

In this case I'd like to think Clee's remarks were to a great point meant in jest as he was replying to Simon 21's positive comment above 'I am pleased as it's all good coverage for the marque it does not really matter which club did it really' and Simon T's subsequent teasing of Simon 21 suggesting he had been on a management course and being very politically correct. Then BIGMVS who's in both clubs (as are many other members) sent a photo aiming the comment straight back at Clee instead. They are always winding each other up.

In fact look at turbo 5's reply, he's a CAR member and he took it as a joke as well. You must remember that at least half of all the visitors are in both clubs. If Clee had been really offensive plenty of people would have let him know.

I've already moderated Clee a couple of times recently and he's picked up on it so I don't want to mod him too much. Technically there was no offensive language as he'd used a # and there were plenty of exclamation marks to indicate he was joking. There were also a few jokes about the missing letter by CAR members. There is an element of freedom of speech here and yes there have been some direct personal comments on forum members for various reasons in the past, some of which have been moderated and some of which have been allowed. For example if someone feels they have had good or bad service from a supplier and want to let people know, it's hardly my place to tell them what they can or can't say. Anyone can defend themself if they wish to do so and many do. In addition the forum is too large now and has too many visitors and posts for me to read and moderate every post on every thread, but you'll normally find that someone will let me know (like you have) if they are particularly upset about something. Don't forget you can always reply yourself directly to a thread if you feel that someone is out of place and I'm happy to post up your comments and my reply if you like.

Please remember as with text messages unless you know the person well and their frame of mind and general nature it's all too easy to read too much into written words or comments and put a different slant on things to that intended. Clee's just a bit of a joker and I'm sure he didn't mean to be obscene.

Committee members like yourself and myself always take things more personally (I know I do) and you'll often find it just goes straight over the head of regular members who have much less of a personal investment of time and effort. By the way Clee's getting more involved with RTOC than RAOC. He even runs the shop for them. He's got great big RTOC stickers down the side of his Alpine and is always winding me up for not sending him big enough RAOC stickers! So who knows what club he'll be in, in 10 let alone 20 years time. I'd like to think he'll still be with us if he has a Renault of some sort, but the way things are going all our Alpines may be banned or fitted with electric motors!



I have since spoken to Clee and he has agreed for my reply to be published publicly. He suggested a forum ban for a short period but I declined his offer as I did not think it was necessary.

I have also checked the obscenity filters on the site and they seem to be working correctly.

Although I have recieved no further response to my reply, I trust this brings matters to a satisfactory conclusion. [/quote]
Trafic, Twingo GT, Vel Satis Turbo x 2, Clio V6 Proto Ph2, Vel Satis 3.5, Avantime, Alpine A610, GTA Atmo x 3, GTA Turbo x 3, R5 Gordini Turbo Mid Engine, Alpine A310 4cyl, Alpine A110, Yellow Smart
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Postby Wrightbr » Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:11 pm

Getting back to the article, about the GTA. Quote 'you really won't find a better example' and 'it's only done 40,000 miles'

It is a really nice example of a GTA but I think my 29,000 mile GTA turbo would give it a run for it's money!! ;0)

Cheers
Brad
alpine v6 turbo 1990
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1990
Leather
Air Con
ABS

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State of the nation

Postby Miles » Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:44 pm

The nanny state is here amongs us oh s##t.!!
Bull##i# paperwork,bureaucracy and passwords.
The reason I left the other club was to many passwords.
OMG you need a password now to view the photos on this site.
I give in.
Lee wheres the application form?

Only joking, But it is the banter that makes this site cool.
We all enjoy the cat fights.
Still facinated to see the Dini which is faster than a formula 1 car.
Now that was a good set of rounds.
Pistols at dawn. Start your engines!
Amen(':lol:')

As Stephen says its a free state, Nobody forces you to read this.


:lol:
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Postby andyh877 » Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:46 pm

let me guess.... it was the person who had a go at me at Prescott for absolutely no reason at all:roll:

shows how true the comment was doesn't it if they've sent a snotagram and are taking it so seriously... dont worry you won't receive any complaints until friday as they'll all be queing down the post office on thursday getting their pensions :lol:

i suggest we give clee a pat on the back 8)

no one forces them to read this forum, theirs is obviously too boring
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Postby Martin Walding » Thu Dec 18, 2008 8:11 pm

Blimey! What a bunfight this has turned out to be!

As the owner of the GTA in the magazine, I volunteered my time and car when C.A.R. were looking for a GTA. Being a member of both clubs I have always tried to help out if possible with publicity and events.

I thought everyone would be happy to see Alpines getting more press coverage, especially R.A.O.C as a large part of the membership own GTA's, having a GTA on the front cover of a magazine must be good publicity. But seeing clubs fall out makes me wonder it the time, effort and expense make if worthwhile.

Regarding clees comments, I know clee from various events and most of his comments are jokey banter with no malice, and his website comments make me laugh.

P.S. Clee - I don't think I'm that old, second comment fair enough!

I suppose to someone who is not a regular to the R.A.O.C. website and did not know clee's vast input, reading it on its own someone could and did take offence - a sense of humour failure? - perhaps but everyone is different.

Anyway, I hope everyone likes the article, it should have had a 610 in it but it didn't show up.

I know the photographer and deputy editior of the the magazine genuinely liked all the cars and tried to get the point across that they are almost anonymous.

As Stephen knows these things take quite a lot of organising we should all be grateful to him and Tim Moores (CAR) for all their time and effort in getting good publicity for the cars
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Postby stephendell » Thu Dec 18, 2008 11:01 pm

Being a member of both clubs I have always tried to help out if possible with publicity and events.


That's true, Martin is always very supportive to both clubs and we're always very happy to have his car on display at events.

I suppose to someone who is not a regular to the R.A.O.C. website and did not know clee's vast input, reading it on its own someone could and did take offence - a sense of humour failure? - perhaps but everyone is different.


Well let's just hope it's a massive sense of humour failure and that my 'explanation' clarifies things. The thread actually started off pretty positive otherwise.

Anyway, I hope everyone likes the article, it should have had a 610 in it but it didn't show up.


Yes, I know. I did offer one retrospectively with a very appropriate number plate :wink: but I think it was a little too late by then...
Trafic, Twingo GT, Vel Satis Turbo x 2, Clio V6 Proto Ph2, Vel Satis 3.5, Avantime, Alpine A610, GTA Atmo x 3, GTA Turbo x 3, R5 Gordini Turbo Mid Engine, Alpine A310 4cyl, Alpine A110, Yellow Smart
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Sense of humour failure!

Postby Tony Smith » Thu Dec 18, 2008 11:20 pm

I wouldn't worry too much about complaints from 'other car clubs' what you have built here in the last 5 years is far better than any club I've been involved with and heres why. More fun, a more relaxed attitude, better organised, more freebies, more events - basically more everything. I was a member of C.A.R for many years but never enjoyed being a member like I have of this club, thats not to say there was anything wrong with it - theres just a few people who take it all too seriously - as the complaint e-mail so aptly proves. The forums would be a much duller place with out the banter here and as far as I know nobody has died from having the p*ss taken out of them. Some of the dodgy stuff they have done behind the scenes is a much more serious breach of 'etiquette' in my opinion.

Come on take the p!ss Lee I dare ya :lol:
Alpines - GTA 3.0 Turbo, GTA 3.0 Inj (Project DD), GTA 6.2 V8 (500 bhp) , R32 Skyline GTR, BMW Alpina B10 635 Highline, Alpina B10 E39 5 Series, Jaguar 4.2 XKR, Laguna 205GT, BMW 120d.
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Postby phildini » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:27 am

."Martin Walding".........Anyway, I hope everyone likes the article, it should have had a 610 in it but it didn't show up.


Please don't tell me Mr Clarkson got his filthy hands on this one too..... :lol: :wink:

ANYWAY I AGREE WITH TONY........ MR DELL WORKS VERY HARD FOR US LOT WITH EVENTS ETC....... I HAVE BELONGED TO MANY CLUBS IN THE PAST, BUT THIS IS FAR THE BEST ONE!!!!!!!!! WOOP WOOP!!!!!!! :D :wink:
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Postby Wrightbr » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:31 am

I too was a member of CAR for many years, but I left because I personally felt that it was not value for money and not really conentrated enough on the GTA.

When I left I started using this forum which has been very useful in my GTA ownership and the people on this forum have always been very very helpful when I need any advise on the GTA.

Also the memebers on here have a great relaxed attitude and always make new members more than welcome.

Stephen - I think that you have a great forum running here, which is informative and light hearted.

Thats my two pennies worth anyway

Cheers
Brad
alpine v6 turbo 1990
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Leather
Air Con
ABS

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Postby BIG_MVS » Fri Dec 19, 2008 9:24 am

Got my copy of Classics Monthly and it's a good article, very positive about the Alpine Marque and kept me occupied on the plane yesterday.

I'm a member of both clubs and think they are both good but completely different, although importantly both passionate about Alpines!

Brad if your not a member of CAR why not this club? Is it another dose of Tightus Maximus :lol: ? Oh and your GTA can't still be on 29k surely :shock: ? Fix that faulty speedo!

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Postby Wrightbr » Fri Dec 19, 2008 9:35 am

Yes it was a good article and hopefully will push up the awareness/prices of GTAs!

I will be joining this comming year (you can hold me to that Stephen!), just lazyness I guess! When does the new subscription start (12 or 6 months?)

Yes still on 29,000 , however it might be going over to 30,000 next year probrably! Really should use it more and stop being a wuss with it, but with another nipper due next year not sure that is going to happen!!

MOT Tester rips me every year because of the mileage done!

Cheers
Brad
alpine v6 turbo 1990
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Leather
Air Con
ABS

Family Car - Kia Picanto Chilli!
Noble M12
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Postby BIG_MVS » Fri Dec 19, 2008 9:45 am

OK I'll let you off! :lol: Steve more commision in my paypal account please for membership fee collection/policing.

Where has clee gone BTW, oh yes filming his new TV commercial no doubt....

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=j2jNLwg_C4Y
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Postby clee » Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:55 am

ImageImageImage
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I dont Know

Postby si21 » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:25 pm

ImageImageImage



you'll be driving a 5 Turbo soon :lol: :lol: :lol:

si21
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Postby clee » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:34 pm

Aiiiiii

I'm quite the Ren-aissance Man innit .
Here for Alpine ,RTOC for the tech and Renaultsport for how to wash and polish .................Ohh and when I've spotted another red car just like mine ................I'm applying for inter-club liason ociffer
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