Alternative GTA conversion.

[Alpineandy]

In a spaceframe Mini

Not the Mini Van in Practical Performance Car mag?

Alpineandy....I replied as I did because he was thinking of sprinting and as far as I know has yet to fully realise the potential of the standard engine. Yank lumps can produce huge power if youve got the money, but I got the impression that he was looking to do it on the cheap!

[Alpineandy]

Yank lumps can produce huge power if youve got the money

I've never owned or tried playing with a yank motor, But I understood that big BHP is produced quite cheap (a friend is a yank fan, But I've so little interest in them that I've never looked under his bonnet). Things like 8 new 'worked on' pistons fot a hundred quid (the set).

FYI : http://www.team.net/sol/tech/engine.html

Yes, but youve got to buy one first and then get things like adaptor plates to fit gearboxes, rig up piping etc. As standard Yank V8s arent always that brilliant.....Ive seen cars with 5+ litre V8s putting out less than 200bhp!!!!!

I don't know if my GTA will be the most powerful British GTA but I have done all the mods that you list Peter - 10 years ago! And then some. Was 260bhp on standard management and injectors. New engine should be well over 300bhp. I was really just trying to establish an alternative power plant really - something different - and preferably non turbo that is cheap, simple and reliable (a bit like me ). V8's offer all this - its just the weight penalty that concerns me and moreover its affect on the handling. AS I said 2k for a fully rebuit 400 bhp lump. To rebuild a prv with decent bits is going to cost that. Then turbo's management etc will make it alot more, and turbo cars are supposed to need 10% more power to make up for the lag compared to the equivalent aspirated car. Have hopefully got a donar car too now. Any body want a quick 21 Turbo - see the for sale section!

I didnt think you'd done cams?? Apparently they are a major leap forward due to the standard ones having possibly the limpest profile ever to be put in a car (somewhere around the 220 deg. mark!).

.... Have hopefully got a donar car too now....

I presume that it isn't mine!!??
On the subject of cams does anyone make them for the 24V engine? DG?

Yes, I have turbo profile cams available for both mechanical and hydraulic setups for the 24v . Venturi Trophy and 600LM spec.

On Peters side, he has got the larger turbo than Tony was running and Tony was still running the Devil exhaust which Pete replaced, but Tony has the good chargercooler system whiich helps to get good HP gains.

I never claimed to have the more powerful car!!!, but I have also got bigger injectors and advanced ignition........once Ive got the prog. ECU and have had it rolling roaded (if I ever get round to it!!) then I will publish figures......at the minute I wouldnt like to say if I have more than 260bhp. Would love cams......next winter I will try and get round to having the engine out and doing them.

Sorry, I never did have cams fitted in the last engine - that was just me not reading the list properly. I'm not trying to big my car up or anything I really hate that my cars faster than yours stuff, just trying to give people the benefit of 14+ years of messing about with GTA's! Its just over time I've tried many things on my own car which people talk about doing now I know some of them good results and others don't. It will be interesting to see what difference the engine management, extra cc's, different cams, and much bigger turbo make.

As an alternative to the ford cosworth engine which can get 400hp pretty easily, what sort of power could be drawn from a Renault 21 engine. If 350hp was possible (and it is a race engine of course) then this would be a far lighter option than the V6.
I saw the article with all the 21's at a rolling road and high 200's was commonplace so surely 350 is possible. What did the Ranault racers run I wonder.
Tho' the guy who had put a V6 in his 21 might have something to add!

Rupert, I think you misread some of the article, the highest reading was 243bhp and he had done a lot to the engine (cams, neads, turbo, you name it!). Most of the others were at or under 200bhp. One of the limitations is that the 21 engine is only 8valve, and from the specs Ive seen I'd imagine (and I'm guessing here) that it has a long stroke and fairly narrow bore....hence why no one appears to have managed big power (narrow bore and long stroke limits valve size and also cc increase.......the Cosworth on the other hand has 16v and a 2.4 conversion is quite common)

The 21 engine is typical of most old Renault turbos. When they are tuned they seem to make a lot more torque than power, so they are getting the boost in at low revs from peak torque, but its then getting restrictive at high revs, lowering top end power.

Even as standard they make 199lb torque and 175bhp, so theres a restriction there already.

As an alternative to the ford cosworth engine which can get 400hp pretty easily, what sort of power could be drawn from a Renault 21 engine. If 350hp was possible (and it is a race engine of course) then this would be a far lighter option than the V6.
I saw the article with all the 21's at a rolling road and high 200's was commonplace so surely 350 is possible. What did the Ranault racers run I wonder.
Tho' the guy who had put a V6 in his 21 might have something to add!

The 21 basic engine is 120kg and the V6 is 170 so its only the difference of a small child for instance.

If you look at the torque readings on those 21 RR figures, youll find the highest power car made peak torque well high up around 4500+, and this is the only reason why it made better power.

You could get more power out of a 1.4 R5 lump! Theyve hit the 300bhp mark now at around 25psi. A friend of mine is running 230bhp, with the engine relocated to the back of the car (its not a Turbo2) and recently done a 3.98 to 60!, and the fastest standing quarter is 12.1 seconds!. Only problem is, we have another 400Kgs to work with.

They actually managed 408bhp out of the 1.4 or should I say the Maxi version which was a bit over 1500cc.........on the 1985 Tour de Corse winning car Ragnotti could switch on water injection for short bursts of power.....408bhp....mad!!!!